The Goldfish and Aquarium Board

by **wendylove** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:44 am

I thought i would post some before and after pictures of Panda paws. She gets her wen trimmed tomorrow. After her trim i will post the after pictures. Her eyes are completely covered now so she will be happy to see again. 
As you can see in the following four pictures her eyes are completely covered. She was experiencing some difficulty navigating the tank. She was also slow to the food. 
<img src="http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c288/prettypleco/DSC02268.jpg"/> 
 
<img src="http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c288/prettypleco/DSC02239.jpg"/> 
 
<img src="http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c288/prettypleco/DSC02267.jpg"/> 
 
Here she is with fish lips Wendy 
 
<img src="http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c288/prettypleco/DSC02240.jpg"/> <hr />Under water where thoughts can breathe Easily... 
Far away you were made in a sea 
Just like me... 
 
 
<a href="http://thegab.org/Eggs/"><img src="http://thegab.org/Eggs/img/0603/egg4.gif"/></a> 
Edited by: <A HREF=http://p103.ezboard.com/bthegoldfishandaquariumboard.showUserPublicProfile?gid=wendylove@thegoldfishandaquariumboard>wendylove</A> <IMG HEIGHT=10 WIDTH=10 SRC="http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c288/prettypleco/DSC003682.jpg" BORDER=0> at: 3/31/06 12:36 pm

by **bludusty** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:43 pm

How on earth do you give a wen haircut to an oranda? I'm astonished about your post. Pardon me if I am just uninformed about this procedure but I can't imagine doing it. I'd rather be over the hill then under it. Art Linkletter

by **Dataguru** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:46 pm

and this time, you HAVE to write an short article on it. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol"> <hr /> 
Betty 
Visit our Sister Site, <a href="http://www.koivetforums.com/forums/index.php" target="top">Koivet</a> for more info on goldfish and koi health. 
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by **wendylove** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 1:36 pm

I have not forgotten the article Betty! <img src=http://thegab.org/images/icons/1087.gif ALT=":bangHead"> And yes this would be a good one too. I have 12 days off in April and will get to it by then. 
As far as the trim job they use sharp little scissors or a scalpel to trim around the eyes. She will be a challenge as her eyes are completely covered now. I would do it but it is too close a cut. <hr />Under water where thoughts can breathe Easily... 
Far away you were made in a sea 
Just like me... 
 
 
<a href="http://thegab.org/Eggs/"><img src="http://thegab.org/Eggs/img/0603/egg4.gif"/></a>

by **Dataguru** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 4:41 pm

Yea... creeps me out too. Scooter's pudgy little cheeks are starting to encroach on his eyes, so I suppose I'll have to deal with that at some point before they get too overgrown. 
 
re the articles. That'll be cool! Did you pull down the x-rays Helen posted on koivet of the cyst? <hr /> 
Betty 
Visit our Sister Site, <a href="http://www.koivetforums.com/forums/index.php" target="top">Koivet</a> for more info on goldfish and koi health. 
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by **bettasngoldfish** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 9:33 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>How on earth do you give a wen haircut to an oranda? I'm astonished about your post. Pardon me if I am just uninformed about this procedure but I can't imagine doing it<hr></blockquote> 
 
I can't imagine doing it myself but I would consider a vet doing it for me if I had a fish who needed it to be done. 
 
Do you have the Fancy Goldfish book by Dr Erik Johnson and Richard Hess? They discuss wen trimming and some other interesting stuff. 
 
And, Good luck to Panda Paws with her trim tomorrow! I hope all goes well <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> 
<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v231/bigmiss/Oliver.jpg"/> 
Time for a nap~ Maria 
 
<a href="http://thegab.org/Eggs/"><img src="http://thegab.org/Eggs/img/0603/egg7.gif"/></a> 
 
Edited by: <A HREF=http://p103.ezboard.com/bthegoldfishandaquariumboard.showUserPublicProfile?gid=bettasngoldfish>bettasngoldfish</A> <IMG HEIGHT=10 WIDTH=10 SRC="http://img76.photobucket.com/albums/v231/bigmiss/DSC00375.jpg" BORDER=0> at: 3/16/06 9:34 pm

by **mudsow** » Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:29 pm

I had enough trouble cutting up a small fish for an autopsy. I KNOW I wouldn't be grabbing a scalpul on a LIVE fish. Not if I intended to keep it a live fish anyway. 
 
Mudsow

by **marigold** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 5:10 am

Good luck Panda Paws!! I can't wait for more pictures - thanks for taking the time to document the procedure. Has anyone here ever done this themselves? I just got a little lionhead who has a fairly thin layer of wen yet, but alread the layer is overlapping his eyes, as it gets thicker there is no doubt it will cover his eyes. I guess I should be looking for a fish vet - would be good info to know in case of an emergency anyway!!<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/eek.gif ALT=":eek"> 
 
Marigold

by **Daisywink** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 12:23 pm

I've done it. It went very well. I had an oranda who's wen had completely covered her eyes. I took the oranda out, put her into a shallow dish with some tank water, and used surgical scissors to cut it away. She only fussed when I had the put the scissors next to her eyes. It bled only a little in one or two places, but only a tiny amount really. She didn't seem to be in pain at all. The wen is like jello and cuts very easily. The trim left her with a bit of a ragged do, but it smoothed over within a month and you couldn't even tell it had been cut!

by **selah123** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 3:08 pm

I could never do this myself.. it must hurt very much even if they don't show it.. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/frown.gif ALT=":(">

by **Daisywink** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 3:12 pm

It is my understanding that fish do not have the same type of nervous system that we have, and it is believed they do not experience the same levels of pain we can. Plus, there is no reason why the wen would be enervated in the first place. It may not feel it at all. But I understand your feeling. It was difficult for me to do it, but the poor fish was having trouble finding its way around the tank, or seeing the food drop. Even with her lateral line, Orandas are already at a disadvantage for swimming and navigating, so it really made a difference to have it trimmed.

by **marigold** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 3:26 pm

I was wondering if there were any nerves in the wen....Probably wouldn't be too hard to find out - maybe Panda Paw's vet will mention this to Wendylove. I would be able to do this if necessary to one of my fish, but would be much less hesitant if I knew there were no nerves involved! Did you just sort of fly blind on this Daisywink (no pun intended!), or did you research it a bit? 
 
Marigold

by **Dataguru** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:07 pm

I wouldn't attempt it without sedating the fish first. 
I wouldn't feel comfortable working that close to their eye with a sharp instrument with them trying to flop around. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> 
 
Here's a good article on a couple of ways to <a href="http://thegab.org/Articles/SedateFinquelCloveOil.html" target="top">sedate fish</a>. Finquel is excellent. Wouldn't be without it. <hr /> 
Betty 
Visit our Sister Site, <a href="http://www.koivetforums.com/forums/index.php" target="top">Koivet</a> for more info on goldfish and koi health. 
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by **wendylove** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:09 pm

They obviously have pain when it is trimmed as Panda Paws got an injection of butorphanol for pain and baytril prophalactically. 
There are nerve endings near the eye so you have to be very careful which is why i had a professional do it. 
I will post the pictures shortly. 
I also found out that in all probability Wendy and Panda are boys!! <hr />Under water where thoughts can breathe Easily... 
Far away you were made in a sea 
Just like me... 
 
 
<a href="http://thegab.org/Eggs/"><img src="http://thegab.org/Eggs/img/0603/egg4.gif"/></a>

by **selah123** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:45 pm

gee I'm not sure I would have bought an oranda had I known about this probablility to face <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/frown.gif ALT=":("> I doubt there is anyone around here that could do such an operation.. how old were your orandas before this needed to be done?

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